The Last Puppet

Name: The Last Puppet
Appearance: almost like something made from the clay doll jutsu except for more complex and refined, humanoid shape about four foot tall with spiked fingers and toes, because it sort of is made using the Clay Doll Jutsu. The torso is also more like a berral large enough to fit a person but with more plentiful and eccentric segments then a berral as well as the arms, legs, and neck are all twice as thick with quick release joints (allowing half or whole appendages to release from the puppet and move independently so long as there is a dedicated chakra thread for them) as opposed to the more solid and simple designs of the clay dolls.
Rank: A
Backstory:
This Puppet is a culmination of Shinoskay's present understanding of construct, by utilization the jutsu that allows him to make spider web like threads out of a combination of bodily fluids and chakra, the Clay Doll jutsu, a refined understanding of Chakra threads, and a working understanding of basic and general construction he has been able to create a more permenent and effective version of the Clay Doll puppetry jutsu construct.

Health: 69
Sharpness: 69
Mechanisms:

1. Puppeteers Partner:

 

Due to the puppet been constructed in part by chakra and jutsu that causes long-term chakra constructs, the puppet is more receptive and able to conduct chakra. So long as you use an additional chakra thread for this puppet, the puppet can use any Tai/weap/chakra thread jutsu/skill up to B rank though it may not benefit from any boosters (boosters defined as Boosts that last more than one post) in the jutsu through this Mechanism, may only use what you know (of course), through the same, and puppet fingers do not count as extra fingers (you may only have as many chakra threads as you would have available to you if you did not have the puppet, even if you use chakra thread jutsu/skills through the puppet). 2 post cooldown between jutsu uses. Any Ap expenditures can be split between the puppet and the puppeteer, rounded up (so if a jutsu costs 5... it is 2.5/2.5 rounded up to 3/3 AP cost for both the puppet and the puppeteer).  
-Attune: In order to use this ability, if you didn't make the puppet, you will need to spend 2000 WC, and at least 2 topics, with the puppet to interact your chakra with it. if it isnt attuned, you may not use this mechanism (all ap sharing mechanisms' functions are nulled) and you may not attune it in the same thread you 'acquired it' so you cant take it from someone during battle and then use this mechanism against them during that same battle even if you manage to hit 2000 wc for attunement.

2. Geomagnetic break away:

 

The segmented parts are held together by a geomagnetic field similar in nature to earths, which is comparable but different to that of a magnet but on a different polarization or wave frequency spectrum (so no interrupting with manufactured or general electromagnetic frequencies) from the same due to been made, largely and in part, from the earth. It is designed so that when struck, it is more inclined to flex and flux to absorb some of the damage before resisting rather then to outright try to resist. Furthermore, this design also allows the puppet to draw new earthen material in exact replication to the lost segments.

Passive 25 DR
40 AP for limbs or limb sized area at speed of 65
20 AP for any area smaller than a limb at speed of 65
Can Ap Share per Puppeteers partner, for this mechanism all ap cost may come from puppet AP.

3. Internal Chakra:

 

It will slowly gather AP from its chakra threads each post, a base of 1 AP per post, as well as AP from jutsu used near it (E=2, D=4, C= 8, B=16, A=25, S=50) for every jutsu used by or near (5 meters) it, or half the AP of any jutsu that it comes into contact with (if it comes into contact with that jutsu, it does not gain AP from that jutsu for proximity as we well, this is an either or function). it can store up to 120 AP. This AP can only be used to use abilities for the puppet it is stored in. The AP remains stored until used (Not emptied at end of thread).

-Produces a chakra signature much like a shinobi would, reads as having a random chakra level at the puppeteers choice (Sensory must be focused to detect the chakra signature if it is below 60) of which has a constantly changing signature due to the chakra supply always been replenished from multiple sources of chakra. Imprecise chakra vision will mistake this for a chakra network.
-Passively, as the mechanism circulates the chakra stored in the puppets AP storage, may apply any element the puppeteer knows for the sake of element advantage/disadvantages or elemental effects.

Since Chakra barriers are such a hot trend

4. Chakra Barrier:

 

The barrier covers the entire outside of the puppet, just an inch above the puppets outter coating and protects it from any damage. It has a base power/speed 69 and can absorb any attack of lower power. If an incoming attack would exceed the power of this barrier, the barrier will absorb all damage that it is able to, subtracting its power from the damage of an incoming attack, before shattering and being put on a 3 post cooldown. The barrier will also serve to filter toxins and other contaminants from the air, filtering them from the air up to the power of the barrier. The barrier does not impede the puppet or user from using any of their techniques. Allowing them to pass through the barrier without issue.

costs 45 AP to activate, 20 to maintain. If shut down or broken through the cooldown will automatically start. This ability scales with jutsu scaling rules. Can Ap Share per Puppeteers partner.

5 The totally safe "Escape 'pod'"?:

 

This puppet likes to break apart, a lot, doesnt sound very safe actually. So in the likely event that the puppeteer wants to get away from his puppet in a hurry, the puppets chest segments can be directed to quickly and crudely encase either what is inside it or what is directly in contact with it (encasing will size to uncomfortably cover the target, while it will attempt to size to 5.25 square feet, a 3.5 feet by 1.5 feet, it can become roughly as large as 8 square feet. However, it does not need to fully encase the target to effect it, partial encasing is acceptable for this feature) to then crassly shunt that target in a chosen directly using much the same mechanics as Body Flicker... the encasing protects the target from harm and will typically break away/off either as they are landing/impact or when they reach the intended distance (the chakra holds it together for the duration of this feature) so as to redirect the momentum of energy and impact away from target. This works in the same way as the body flicker technique, and lasts for up to new speed in meters.

Naturally, this can't be used in the same post as the body flicker technique.

This mechanism costs 10 AP from both the puppet and the puppeteer.

Word count to build:  5500
Character Specific: ooc permission from shinoskay or mods
Bonus Requirements: no

Welcome to another episode of 'What Bloodline is It?' I'm your host, Valen Akari! 

Just Kidding

But seriously though, I see 6 abilities on a puppet that caps at 5. Let's fix that. 

Ability 1: As far as I know the ONLY precedent for this is in the form of a skill that only really allows it to happen because it's a mech puppet. Which means the puppeteer is in the nitty gritty too. Since they're INSIDE of it while the techniques are being used. I view this as an attempt to lolnope the only risk involved in those two specs. So that's going to be a no from me bud. 

Ability 2: Oh look, the Hozuki bloodline with Earth, and without the elemental disadvantage to boot. With the ability to fully regenerate the puppets limbs for the low low AP cost of 10 AP. Or the puppet itself for that matter. I don't really care if it IS made from Earth, if someone already managed to destroy your puppet with a physical attack, which is already difficult as hell because that involves getting close to the thing that moves faster in general than almost anyone in straight up movement (As long as your stat allocation wasn't done by a 5 year old) but they have to contend with the puppet abilities that do not require hand seals. Making it exceedingly difficult to destroy the things in general. Yet you want it it to be completely immune to physical damage effectively? Absolutely not. If you were to ask for a second opinion then the individual health of your joints would be the same as the rest of the puppet (65) I assume that 69 was a typo to be honest. 

The third ability: You want to bypass the stamina stat by making your puppet have AP and split AP costs with you? That's not happening. Not only that, but it's three abilities in one. A battery, a booster, and an explosion. IF you were to ask for a second opinion on this, you would still need hard A rank numbers, and an proper upkeep. Upkeep costs are half initial. So for a 40 initial drop it's 20 upkeep a post. 

The barrier: Checks out, good, standard shit. However, add in where the barrier originates from.

The escape pod, you need some numbers here pal. How fast does the puppets encasing do it's thing? I assume it has some kind of build in impact dampeners to prevent you from dying the moment the pod crashes into something? You might wanna slide that into lest you be vagued into a sad suicide. But you say it launches at the combination or your speed and chakra stat? As per Body Flicker rules? That's not going to be alright. We like flat numbers here, this is an A rank puppet, so the best you're gonna get is 60 scaling. The AP cost needs to be adjusted too, A rank ability, A rank costs. If you do 60 scaling, it'll be 45 AP as per standard. 

The Hybrid Cannon: An interesting technique, I'm getting random visualization of Mu La Flaga's Gun Barrels from Gundam Seed. 

'The physical projectile is made from enough physical elements that it is not blocked or hindered in any way by anything that would hinder/block chakra.'


You mean if a chakra barrier stats anything that impacts it it reduces the force by the power, etc? No, the only way you could bypass a chakra barrier is with piercing which just involves ignoring the jutsu health rules. I can't think of a single example of a defensive ability that ONLY blocks chakra. If you know of one, feel free to point it out. 


Again with the hard numbers. You have an A rank puppet, it get's A rank level abilities. That means 50 or 60. Do not base it off sharpness of your puppet, because that would be silly. 'Lol lemme buff my puppet sharpness and make my A rank level ability an S rank one.' No. 

'30 Chakra' Typo fix Pl0x, as well an AP fix, if you go 60 as before it's gonna cost ya 45 AP a shot. 

This needs a CD too. 

Bump when ready.

*Edit: it is only after recieving stupid downvotes that I will point out how ridiculous it is to compare the hozuki bloodline ability to the puppets... I could go into great detail how ridiculous it is but I mentioned this more so to show you I refrained from all of that sillyness and only presented a little as a means of 'glaring'. as a means of saying 'I could have... I wanted to... but I am trying to be nice and so I didnt'*

So actually most of these are rip edits similar to other puppet apps, in fact I made this after researching the other puppets for like two weeks or so. So either look at them inclusively or be prepared to cry shake your head as I counter your 'stop trying to have everyones skills and blood lines for free' 'this is not like the others' by showing you where exactly they are similar and where I have edited them.

Also, it is 5 mechanisms... a puppet gets mechanisms... not abilities... the mechanisms get abilities... this A rank puppet has 5 mechanisms. That last thing is an ability from 3 seperate mechanism's explicitly working in tandem and is stated to explicitly require all three mechanisms to be fully operational in order to use the one ability.

Ability 1:
Your lol nope is denied on the real, I am pretty sure you mean aryll's 'I am a cripple so my puppet is my body' thing. I am not aryll, my write up is different, with different circumstances, and with differences come different benefits and weaknesses. Pretty sure another requirement of arylls is that hers requires her to be a cripple. Lets stay inclusive here and not comepare two seperate apps, with different circumstances and balances, to each other. If you cant do that, I will ask that you hand the app off to someone who can (not nocking or challanging you). if you insist on saying mine needs to be more like hers, I can start the barrage of why this is more balanced....

By the By, the weakness to this mechanism is that it is semi dependent on the battery. I considered actually combining the two but then it would lose its weakness and become more complicated so for the sake of not getting more crazy here I opted not to combined the two mechanisms. for the record, I brain childed this withouth 'inspiration' from anyone elses app's. its an idea ive had ever since I first played a puppeteer on my first naruto forum, way back when.

Ability 2: Actually, this is a edited rip version of another puppets mechanism. because of the rules I won reference it... but anyways I didnt take this idea from a bloodline.
The regen thing was actually because in my mask app I was told that such an item regen option could be available in such a way. the 69 is from the other puppet and was an oversight. Edited it to right.
It doesnt say it can regenerate the puppet, granted it only needs a little bit of the puppet to regenerate from. I am unfamiliar with the hozuki bloodline.

Ability 3: This is another rip edit also  a version of another puppets mechanism, the explosion effect came with the mechanism and I felt it was more of a draw back then a benefit because if a rupture occurs then the puppet gets sent into a bunch of peices as well as half of the mechanisms lose a lot of there power if not all use period. Sure, it COULD be weaponized for me, but since it says if... and there is no way for me to trigger it myself unless I intentionally destroy/rupture it (thus requiring me to also be in range of it, and I am not immune to it)... well I actually that thats nuff said on the 'explosive effect'.

The 'battery' is a passive effect... one that I atually probably could have just put on mechanism 1. the booster is the active effect and is mostly here to better balance the risk that the 'battery' presents... as mentioned twice now, I kept this mechanism seperate from the first one primarily because I felt the explosion draw back made the whole thing viable and more obviously balanced then if I just Combined the passive to mechanism 1.

barrier: sure

that totally safe escape pod?: speed of body flicker, it fast wraps and shunts you all at speed of body flicker because.... chakra?....(cameo to, because magic... I think waving my fingers would make this but you cant see my fingers) Again, this is another rip 'inspired by another puppet mechanism'. since the encasing is from the puppet, held together by chakra until it reaches its destination, the encasing has a health of the puppet stuff (65) seen here: (the puppets chest segments can be directed to quickly and crudely encase either what is inside it or what is directly in contact with it ). Now, I also added that if the target is too large for the max dimensions then the encasing can operate on a partial level so I suppose it is entirely possible for something, or someone, to get shunted at body flicker speed without a 65 health protective shell. I honestly didnt really think about how such could be vagued that way and honestly I dont care if it is a risk, I am small enough to fit the cramp dimensions (as are most characters) so I feel that any character using this puppet will be fine with this mechanism. if you want me to add in what body flicker does into the mechanism's ability write up then I will do so, I just ask that you clarify that such is what you want. wait, I suppose you are talking about impact damage? like, its not the fall that kills you but the sudden stop? thats kind of why its suppose to be cramped, you get send kind of like a cannon ball and the segments take the impact hence why 'break away/off either as they are landing or when they reach the intended distance'. I suppose I can make that more clear and say landing/impact? I will edit that in just encase in case. it also says 'so as to redirect the momentum of energy and impact away from target' to clarify that the encasing breaks away as a protective means. ever drop a psp or a cell phone with a bunch of loose pieces? know how they just fall apart when they hit the ground but once you piece them back together they are fine? (my friend dropped his psp from a 5 story window once, still worked afterward) thats the idea here.


that hybrid mechanism action:
hmm, I think i was more thinking about chakra or ap based DR barriers... or like the semehada . I know a few things that count as DR because they absorb chakra based attacks. So, like, as a hypothetical, if the 'bullet' somehow had a sharpness higher then samehada's sharpness and health and I shot at it... xyzer couldnt mitigate the damage by saying the sword absorbs a portion of the damage because 'it was/is chakra'. or if someone has a jutsu absorbing barrier, they cant say 'nope, fuck you, I absorb that'. That was the idea behind the physical shot thing.

eh, 45 ap T.T edited
The physical shot is a piece of puppet, so I feel sharpness is fine here... but the chakra shot I agree should be 60. both have inherent benefits and weaknesses... edited in the chakra shot power. also added in beam fun to balance the ap cost.

I think I got everything.

You remove the weaknesses of two entire specs with absolutely no drawbacks. The original version inherently put the user in danger as all Tai users and Weaponry users are when fighting. That's the only thing that makes the app balanced in my opinion. That's either going to need to be removed, or you're going to have to request a second opinion. 

With your second ability, you took it from an app that was from 2014, the start of V6. A good number of these apps aren't really balanced any longer, and weren't really to begin with honestly. They simply weren't archived because they're still a part of V6 and no one really looked closely at them. I'll have someone move it, but being able to be immune to physical force isn't going to be a thing. 

Different apps are balanced differently. Item apps, weapons, armor, puppets, jutsu, all have their things that would work for them or and not. Sure, being able to channel chakra into a mask you constantly wear to regenerate the material is doable. Mainly because the mask itself tends to be fairly harmless. Being able to channel chakra into your puppet to do the same is completely different. You get to pop your puppet back together over and over with no issue and what does it cost you? AP? AP cost isn't a feasible drawback. Regenerating a puppet in combat, isn't happening without some kind of separate ability to do so. Like the skill the original creator of the mechanism I'll be going into below made to do so. Otherwise, if you're merely looking for a way to repair it out of combat in case it's ever damaged. You can easily say 'This puppet can repaired out of combat for 1000 words or something. You can also, always remake them. Unless it's some kind of super amazing badass CD puppet you got handed down to you by the gods. Nothing really stops you from building another one as far as I am aware (A full mod might object to that though..) 

The explosion is a drawback, and a good one. But it's one drawback that you have here is completely negated by the ability I just pointed out. It doesn't matter if you blow up your own puppet if you just regenerate it. Want to put the appropriate drawbacks? First off make it base chakra stat (Meaning it's cap won't increase when you use a booster, etc.) Then make it require you actually channel an ability that absorbs chakra. Like the original appers. Then remove the booster from it because at that point it gets an AP pool to draw from, a booster, and an explosion. The booster alone is generally it's own ability. Let alone the other two. 

Escape pod: This one is actually fine if you make the speed of the escape pod the users chakra stat. Which is the same as the originals. Body flicker speed is speed + chakra, which is not happening on a puppet when the users speed wouldn't even be used for this. However since you won't inherently be inside of the thing like the original creators you will either need to remove it's ability to 'encase what is in contact with it' and make it so you have to get inside of it (A suicidal thing in combat) or attach a speed stat to it's encasing you. This would be a max of 60, putting the cost for this tech  at 45.

So you're talking about using the interlocking pieces as 'ammunition' at this point? That's all well and good, but that would inherently be on that mechanism because it would legitimately just be a matter of 'pointing his finger at them and launching it' or something which would have it's sharpness. The problem, is that it's also a chakra cannon. Even with your core, you can't have that without it being it's own separate ability. 

For the record, I personally find that stupid rule about bringing up other apps ridiculous. Feel free to mention them to me if I'm modding something for you. For all you know it could actually be an issue that should never have been approved. I will however ask that you do so through PM. I'll also reiterate that I specified If 'I' am modding something for you. Another staff member might not like it. I however, prefer to go by the precedent set. Provided it's a precedent that doesn't need to be looked at again. 

I think I got everything.

*Ready*

Quote :

You remove the weaknesses of two entire specs with absolutely no drawbacks. The original version inherently put the user in danger as all Tai users and Weaponry users are when fighting. That's the only thing that makes the app balanced in my opinion. That's either going to need to be removed, or you're going to have to request a second opinion. 

Well I already told you that if you cant look inclusively then please have another trial mod look this over, because right here is like the opposite of the actuality.

literally a puppeteer in arylls position can just say fuck health and wear a puppet body suit to fight in... using the puppet suit a there health? and thats ok to you? if it werent for that the puppets strength is based on the puppeteers speed, they may even say fuck speed too because they can just move at puppet speeds. A few of the sites I have been on actually ban puppeteers from using their puppets as 'armor' for this very reason.

you said it yourself on skype, I think it was on skype. its hard to fight a puppet because of how fast it moves (I think grim has bragged over and over again about having 165 or some such puppet speed and he doesnt even have max chakra stat  last I checked) and its sealless mechanisms and etc. Would you rather HAVE to fight a puppet... or would you rather look for the puppeteer, who isnt protected by the puppets health and speed, and just take him out... thus taking out the puppet as well.... like, that sounds like some pretty inherent weaknesses and drawbacks to been a puppeteer outside of your puppet as opposed to inside it where shit is a whole lot safer. so like, pretty sure the OPPOSITE of what you just said here is the actual truth. Furthermore, Aryll's skill gives her 'focus points' that she can use for FREE mechanism and melee combat techniques use. This is why I said I was pretty sure I could actually combine the battery mechanism to the puppeteer partner mechanism... cause thats literally a thing already on this forum, but instead I am using two slots for it and giving it at least three major draw backs (I will cover those later).

now, continuing on this, because I feel it will speed things up if I just get straight to presenting the side by side comparison.

so here is aryll's 'my puppet is my body' skill.

Quote :

Backstory: As Aryll developed her skills with puppetry, she began to shift her attention towards the art of Kenjutsu. While her own physical capabilities were lacking, the abilities that she gained by acting vicariously through her puppets were growing stronger every day. Her swordsmanship skills, demonstrated with her puppets acting as prosthetics, were becoming quite impressive, and the divide between herself and her machines was growing smaller with each day. This ability is derived from this growing connection to her machinery.
Effect: Allows Aryll to use weaponry techniques and weapon abilities through her puppets, such as chakra infusion abilities. Her puppets cannot gain stat boosts from any weaponry technique, unless the technique explicitly applies a boost to puppets, or a substat, such as throwing speed. She may use any weaponry technique that she knows through her puppets this way, as long as the puppet is using the appropriate weapon (For larger puppets, the scale of the weapon must be applicable to the technique in order to use)

In addition, because of her continued familiarity and increasingly powerful connection to her puppets, Aryll’s puppets receive a +20 to swing speed when using techniques that utilize an appropriate weapon.

Bonus Requirements: This ability is developed as a result of Aryll’s disability. Should she regain her ability to walk, this ability will be rendered unusable.

so, right away, part of its write up is the idea that she is limited and flawed as a shinobi and so she needs augments... a puppet body to do her bidding.

the puppet is enclosed, entirely, and she can do that because of her byakugon... thus preventing the possibility of area attacks to bypass the puppet to hit her and it gives a passive buff to the techniques used through the puppet.

The skill is nice but then she also has this jutsu

Quote :

http://naruto-role-play-rpg.forumotion.com/t37066-one-body#291243

its a lot to quote, so the idea is an expansion upon the steel body in that she now shares senses with it and now gets stacks for free technique and mechanism use. and it gives a massive buff to... her? her puppet? the buff like I get the buff goes to her but then inherently that then buffs the puppet becuse thats how pupeteering works. additional, she gets a replacement to her health stat, speed, and strength. my god the buffs she gets.

Mine gets a small ap storage share (while in my present state this is a nice little boost but when I go up in rank, in the long run, this will be a tiny drop in the hat so thats why I want to up it a little so it is viable until I make an S rank puppet... at which time, if I get this function recognized and approved, I will up it for S rank level so that it becomes S level viable at that time. All with the draw back that it can be destroyed for the thread, at the least. Also, once we work pan out the break away a little more then it will also pose a risk to the puppet as a whole too...

(side note, holy shit she has a lot of skills)

Valen Akari wrote:

With your second ability, you took it from an app that was from 2014, the start of V6. A good number of these apps aren't really balanced any longer, and weren't really to begin with honestly. They simply weren't archived because they're still a part of V6 and no one really looked closely at them. I'll have someone move it, but being able to be immune to physical force isn't going to be a thing. 

ssoooooooo lets talk about updating the mechanics used from that app then? as they say in the army, is that too logical? while I agree that it is probably a bit too vague... the idea doesnt seem to me to be that it is immune to physical damage. It seems to me that its more like when your psp or phone falls and instead of the impact just destroying your device its pieces just go flying out... thus redistributing impact energy outward and both minimizing actual damage. the way I worded it implied that parts could still be destroyed... why would I need regeneration if things arent getting damage?

Valen Akari wrote:

Different apps are balanced differently. Item apps, weapons, armor, puppets, jutsu, all have their things that would work for them or and not. Sure, being able to channel chakra into a mask you constantly wear to regenerate the material is doable. Mainly because the mask itself tends to be fairly harmless. Being able to channel chakra into your puppet to do the same is completely different. You get to pop your puppet back together over and over with no issue and what does it cost you? AP? AP cost isn't a feasible drawback. Regenerating a puppet in combat, isn't happening without some kind of separate ability to do so. Like the skill the original creator of the mechanism I'll be going into below made to do so. Otherwise, if you're merely looking for a way to repair it out of combat in case it's ever damaged. You can easily say 'This puppet can repaired out of combat for 1000 words or something. You can also, always remake them. Unless it's some kind of super amazing badass CD puppet you got handed down to you by the gods. Nothing really stops you from building another one as far as I am aware (A full mod might object to that though..) 

I feel most of this mechanism IS a mechanism for this effect... sure I am trying to argue to extend the mechanism into allowing a sort of transformation to hybradize with two other mechanisms but outside of that... if not to restore itself after significant damage then what do you think this mechanism is for?

However, you are actually making suggestions here so out of respect for that; the idea here, to me, was mostly that it fit the design of the puppet in my perspective. since it was made from earthen material and chakra then it shouldnt be terribly hard to repair. How about we make this take time? like it can only regenerate so much per post rather then, say, a whole torso or limb in a single post?

Valen Akari wrote:

The explosion is a drawback, and a good one. But it's one drawback that you have here is completely negated by the ability I just pointed out. It doesn't matter if you blow up your own puppet if you just regenerate it. Want to put the appropriate drawbacks? First off make it base chakra stat (Meaning it's cap won't increase when you use a booster, etc.) Then make it require you actually channel an ability that absorbs chakra. Like the original appers. Then remove the booster from it because at that point it gets an AP pool to draw from, a booster, and an explosion. The booster alone is generally it's own ability. Let alone the other two.

Well, if we smooth out the break away, then the explosion will be a draw back still.

I feel like making an entire mechanism as a draw back for the puppet is just illogical... sure, it could be argued that its pretty much one mechanism taking up two slots but since you are so adamant the previous mechanisms change then what is this a drawback for? why are you telling me to major nerf and yet keep all the bad parts of the slotted drawback mechanism? Sure, you are allowing much more limited aspects of the battery but it just isnt viable. 100 chakra at most? not even an academy student gets 100 chakra, samehada the chakra sword gets more chakra then that. I want this to be more viable then 100 chakra storage,

Valen Akari wrote:

Escape pod: This one is actually fine if you make the speed of the escape pod the users chakra stat. Which is the same as the originals. Body flicker speed is speed + chakra, which is not happening on a puppet when the users speed wouldn't even be used for this. However since you won't inherently be inside of the thing like the original creators you will either need to remove it's ability to 'encase what is in contact with it' and make it so you have to get inside of it (A suicidal thing in combat) or attach a speed stat to it's encasing you. This would be a max of 60, putting the cost for this tech  at 45.

this mechanism is based on a puppet mechanism that works exactly like body flicker but only once. I will just include there write up since we are doing this

Quote :

When Aryll decides it's time to bail, she can activate Ludwig's emergency protocols. When activated, one of Ludwig's hatches will open (Chosen at launch) and Aryll is forcibly ejected using a combination of low-impact chakra cannons that do not injure her, and chakra-based stimulants that increase her movement speed drastically. The result is that any entity (Which is defined as "A thing that exists," if you were curious) that exits the puppet this way gets a boost in movement speed equal to Aryll's chakra stat. This works in the same way as the body flicker technique, and lasts for just one post.

Naturally, this can't be used in the same post as the body flicker technique.

This ability costs 10 AP and can only be used once per topic.

So "one of Ludwig's hatches will open (Chosen at launch)" the mechanism moves at speed of body flicker...

And
"and Aryll is forcibly ejected using a combination of low-impact chakra cannons that do not injure her, and chakra-based stimulants that increase her movement speed drastically."

she is shunted with no protection using thruster like devices... and recieves no damage...

Also, I think you need to re read it, cause your required edit would nerf it further ontop of all the other nerfs you are telling me you want me to add. here, I will show you.

"This one is actually fine if you make the speed of the escape pod the users chakra stat. Which is the same as the originals. Body flicker speed is speed + chakra, which is not happening on a puppet when the users speed wouldn't even be used for this."

what you said: "speed of the escape pod the users chakra stat"

what she wrote: "gets a boost in movement speed equal to Aryll's chakra stat"

the difference here is hers gives her a BOOST to her speed equal to her chakra stat, it doesnt just work at chakra stat.

now, I do agree that, on principle, with the nature of my mechanism it doesnt make sense... persay... to use speed and chakra stat of user... and its not balanced to use the speed of the puppet plus the chakra stat of the user. so since the circumstances and write up of my app are different I am willing to re work this regarldess of your reason for why you want it nerfed... just I dont think it should be just at chakra stat. the equation of body flicker effetively (if they do the 100+100 thing) puts people at 200 (225 or 250 with items or passives) movement... puppet speed, inherently, is going to be at 120 (100 chakra stat+20 from threads) maybe 145 or 170. this means that the mechanism will get a nerf regardless if it is changed to something other then the body flicker write up. while I feel like I want to argue against such a nerf... I have been looking at the puppet in a whole rather then each mechanism individually so I feeel that this nerf is small enough that it wont be terrible. I am willing to, and will, edit the equation from the body flicker one to instead puppet speed. I would like to add 25 or 50 to the speed of that but I will wait to see what you think of this.

Valen Akari wrote:

So you're talking about using the interlocking pieces as 'ammunition' at this point? That's all well and good, but that would inherently be on that mechanism because it would legitimately just be a matter of 'pointing his finger at them and launching it' or something which would have it's sharpness. The problem, is that it's also a chakra cannon. Even with your core, you can't have that without it being it's own separate ability. 

I think what this is missing is cannon dimensions... the idea here is that the entire puppet reshapes into a cannon... think sniper rifle, bazooka, or some other similar long berral. hell, a long berral or just something resembling a pcp pipe would be an acceptable visualization.

I think the comment towards the chakra cannon can be answered instead by ignoring the idea of chakra cannon and more considering the conceptual idea that I am trying for a hybrid mechanism transformation from puppet to a sort of puppet mechanics rules weapon idea here. if it helps.... think about soul eater, that is a decent comparison in my mind, I am going for a soul eater weapon concept.

the ammunition visualization is close enough though, yes... the idea is that the cannon is shooting a finger joint or something like that.

Valen Akari wrote:

For the record, I personally find that stupid rule about bringing up other apps ridiculous. Feel free to mention them to me if I'm modding something for you. For all you know it could actually be an issue that should never have been approved. I will however ask that you do so through PM. I'll also reiterate that I specified If 'I' am modding something for you. Another staff member might not like it. I however, prefer to go by the precedent set. Provided it's a precedent that doesn't need to be looked at again. 

I think I got everything.

stupid or not, its a rule... while I appreciate your release of limitations and respect your desire for precedent. I am kind of a stickler for rules, I am a technical thinker after all and so it is important for me to operate within a universal set of rules. I will try, though, and I will also be open minded in consideration for your perspective... like has been done for the aryll puppet body flicker thing. and my puppeteers partner vs her 'i am a cripple so the puppet is my body' things.

Actually, if you want to get into the real technical aspects. Then your first mechanism isn't a mechanism at all. It's a skill. In what way does this particular puppet give you the ability to do this with it when it's you doing the work and drawing from a separate core of power? I'd rather see this as a skill in general. 

'ssoooooooo lets talk about updating the mechanics used from that app then? as they say in the army, is that too logical? while I agree that it is probably a bit too vague... the idea doesnt seem to me to be that it is immune to physical damage. It seems to me that its more like when your psp or phone falls and instead of the impact just destroying your device its pieces just go flying out... thus redistributing impact energy outward and both minimizing actual damage. the way I worded it implied that parts could still be destroyed... why would I need regeneration if things arent getting damage?'

For when you blow up your own puppet for starters, but that's irrelevant. It can not seem to you to not be immune to physical damage all you want. But that's how I'm reading it and that's why I'm not okay with it. If I smash this puppet with a 300 power hammer, you're just going to detach it, bring it back immediately, and it's like I never did any damage at all. Also, you want average of speed and strength AND scaling? Pick either a flat number with scaling, or the average of speed and strength. 


100 chakra storage is all you're getting. I'm not letting you invalidate the stamina stat and circumvent the recent rank up AP removal by shoving a puppet battery that caps at like 195 AP (The equivalent of almost 20 stamina) . Either limit the AP storage, or remove the mechanism. I don't really care which.

 
Regarding the escape hatch, take the body flicker equation at that point. I missed that wording on her version. 

The entire puppet can reshape into a cannon all it wants. In order to be able to fire the cannon it would have to be apped as it's own mechanism. It doesn't get to be some random sixth ability you put on. My recommendation? You're going to have to remove that first mechanism anyway. Make that one a cannon of some kind. 

Feel free to bump when ready and you're of course welcome to a second opinion.

I would rather this be considered for what it is, I made it into two mechanisms to balance it out (aryll's build, albeit much more capable, is a jutsu and a skill... mine is just doing it differently.) the drawback in and of itself is that I can only do it with this puppet, I dont get to suddenly use other puppets for taijutsu, only this one unless I use the same mechanisms or work something else out to use. a skill lets you use it on all puppets, the mechanism is slotted and lets you only use it on the puppet with the mechanism.

I am not intent on blowing up my own puppet, the battery is not a weapon, stop saying that. you even finally admitted to seeing that it was a drawback. I added the booster to explicitly balance the drawback because I felt it was just too much to have a slot with like 10(maybe 20) percent benefit and 90(maybe 80) percent drawback

besides, I JUST said, in the quoted text you presented, "lets talk about updating the mechanics used from that app then?" so get off your trip, take off the blinders, and lets talk shop on it eh? (and actually, the detatch it and bring it back thing DOES sound hozuki, I looked at the blood line after you mentioned it... quite frankly tho I dont see an issue with detatching a limp BEFORE impact and then re attatching it AFTER the attack has passed. but saying thats hozuki is like saying that medical eye bloodline is byakugon or that the huyi or whatever, nobunaga is, is senju... or that senju is uzumaki lol. its similar sure and it kinda makes you think of them but that doesnt mean it was the derived origin.

It seems like it could be DR, I keep thinking DR, do you feel DR?

storage at 200 wont invalidate.... however after looking at this twice, and the math you just presented shows a certain perspective, that I can now compare it to the 10 passive and 20 active standard. So at 10 passive stamina thatd be 100 and at 20 passive thatd be 200... crap... but now that I math it I feel even more validated in my initial request. So SUBSTAT boosts, passive or active, are always twice a primary stat boost. I feel like I can compare this to the boosts from an item, of which tends to give a 25 passive primary stat boost... since the boost is dependent on the item, however I also recognize that jutsu use much the same math as skills and these are suppose to be equatable to jutsu right? I am conflicted, it has the item dependency, but most rule references for a puppet are directed to the jutsu rules.

Now, I do recognize that since this isnt just a straigt storage, there are other aspects to it as well, and so I am inclined to awknowledge that whether comparable to an item or to a jutsu... it should still probably be about half either.... since there are two effects or functions of the mechanism.

so, here is the math I am thinking... either item (25) substat (x2) the mechanism has two functions (1/2) puetting it at 250 pre boost... I dont recall how active effects compare to passives on items at this moment, I think they double but I cant recall.

or skill (10) yada (x2) yada (1/2) putting it at 100. (I can already see you wanting to say this one, just keep in my what precedent that sets)

if its like a jutsu, I dont immediately recall what they typically have for passive's but an A rank level buff is 50, I dont know if that doubles for substat, so that puts the ap costing function at 25 (250)... which half would be about 100..

and we have mathed it out... so item math or skill/jutsu math? how do you think this math should be adjusted since it is a puppet. I am not happy with the mathing results but I cannot dispute the balance it presents.

I am still pretty adamant about the puppeteers partner mechanism. perhaps we can finish up the other mechanisms... get everything else ironed out and balanced... then go back and look at it with the new balance ratio's in place (for instnce, weighing it with the explosive draw back... etc.)

at this moment, I may have had an argument previous and I may have an argument in the future, I do not have any arguments or retorts to defend the existance of the cannon shift function. I really, really, really want the hybrid feature, but I can presently think of at least 3 ways to do this better and so it seems illogical at this time to defend having it.

SAving for later:

 

1.2/2.2/3.2. Hybrid battery cannon:

 

The puppet comes with a unique feature that allows it to switch from a puppet to a chakra cannon type weapon due to the break away mechanism, the chakra battery, and the puppeteers partner mechanism all working together. This weapon has the health of the puppet, fires at the speed of the puppet, the physical shot fires with power equal to the puppets sharpness and the chakra shot fires with a power of 60, with a range of 100 meters and scales per jutsu rules. In order to fire the weapon, you must have the chakra thread dedicated to the weapon as per Puppeteers partner.


You can either fire a physical projectile by paying 5 chakra to form a 'joint' to be fired or you can fire a chakra projectile. The physical projectile is made from enough physical elements that it is not blocked or hindered in any way by anything that would hinder/block chakra.
The physical shot trajectory can be semi controlled by a chakra thread mid flight while the chakra shot fires as a straight beam and can be moved in the same post (origionating from 'The Last Puppet'.
Whether a physical or a chakra projectile, it is 45 chakra to fire the cannon. 2 post cooldown between shots.
The chakra projectile may be any element that you have learned, this only allows chakra element advantage/disadvantages or elemental effects mechanics. This AP cost can be shared per puppeteer partner.

Must have all three mechanism's available, and whole, in order to use this feature(if the battery is ruptured, it will not change. if the puppet is missing any joints or segments, it will not change.)

Alright, my headache medication is kicking in. Let's get started 

I am sorry, but that first ability is definitely a skill imo. The puppet isn't the one doing the work, you are. Which prevents it from being a mechanism in my eyes. 

The intent can be that you ferry konoha shinobi across the sea to visit kiri with each individual parts for all I care. The INTENT doesn't matter, the possible usage does. Boosters are abilities of their own. Especially puppet boosters because you can utilize it to buff the puppet while you're using another to buff your own stats. Effectively stacking them, I'm sorry but simply 'attaching it for balance' isn't going to cut it my friend. 

Now then...AP isn't really substat...and substats aren't double in most situations. You can't add 50 power to your tech from an item. Because you can only allocate 25 of that total of 50 to one substat. For balance purposes. But I digress, the amount of sub stats you an get from a normal active booster is 25. Total, as in you can have 15 power and 10 speed to jutsu if you want. You could do 25 power too. 

I'm confused as to where you're getting the numbers 250, and 100 from in your math. You tell me what the 25 and 10 are but I'm not seeing HOW you're getting to those last two. That might just me not really being awake anymore (yay work). 

Also, are you asking if you can make your tech DR? Also your mechanism is almost exactly like Hozuki because it allows it to lolnope physical damage all day long. Just like they do, and in a similar fashion, by essentially falling apart. Now, you could probably convince me to put a cap on the physical resistance. Since right now it's simply an uncapped ability to go 'Lol you hit me with 300 power with my 65 health but nothing happens'. Why not 200? So if someone manages to smack your puppet with over 200 power in physical damage, they effectively break the parts of the puppet BEFORE it can fall apart or something. Idk, like I said not awake anymore lol.

I am still adamant about that mechanisms base purpose.
everythink except for

Spoiler:

 

Also, are you asking if you can make your tech DR? Also your mechanism is almost exactly like Hozuki because it allows it to lolnope physical damage all day long. Just like they do, and in a similar fashion, by essentially falling apart. Now, you could probably convince me to put a cap on the physical resistance. Since right now it's simply an uncapped ability to go 'Lol you hit me with 300 power with my 65 health but nothing happens'. Why not 200? So if someone manages to smack your puppet with over 200 power in physical damage, they effectively break the parts of the puppet BEFORE it can fall apart or something. Idk, like I said not awake anymore lol.

looks like it is either going in circles or is something you need to re observe. I will try to explain the math with more clarity if that is what you need but you are indeed wrong on the active item buff statement. I just got an active 25 speed buff item, and there is another, newer, item with the same exact buff. Furthrmore, since you like precedence Grim gets an effective +50 to his puppetry (a substat)... (but then his app isnt this app, and this is why we shouldnt compare or reference apps)

I am not seeking to make it anything specific, whether DR or whatever. there are plenty of things that lol nope to physical damage, I already addressed that comparison. it is hard for me to rectify in my mind you starting, briefling touching on, mechanics discussion just to go back to 'this is too much like that... what the shit' again. seeing you do that is frustrating, even if you go back into mechanics talk, please be mindful of things like this. I get you are writing your thoughts down, like I largely am, as you think through this but I too am still having to filter out certain things in an attempt to be mindful.

a damage cap? I can roll with that, sure, I will put that in to the mechanism.

so to clarify on the math, a substat is a stat derived from a stat... AP total is largely determined by stamina, if you have 10 stamina then you get 100 ap.... thus making AP mathematically equatable to a substat with a percievable preportion ratio. in most situations a substat boosts can be up to twice the stat boost because they are more situational while the pirmary stat is general enough to more easily work on more then just the intended substat.

the number 25 comes from that an item can passively boost a primary stat by 25.... that is the standard at this time. So if you put that into stamina... then calculate AP derived from that stamina... you have 250... because 1 stamina equals 10 AP.

so, assuming we are going to go with the skill/jutsu level AP storage math, With the damage cap you just proposed, the chakra battery at the 100 capacity, that you said you wanted and that I just mathed out and awknowledged, it would not be enough to damage the puppet as is... however, while boosted, if at 250 (also mathed out) ap it would become enough to damage the puppet. this in and of itself would be a hard argue for balance and fairness because the likelyhood of it getting damaged at 250 (unless someone intentionally juiced it and then broke it), I awknowledge that... however the moment the battery is damaged this entire mechanism no longer becomes available... regardless of the status of the rest of the puppet. In addition, at least one other mechanism loses partial functionality as it draws from this mechanism. THAT sounds balanced to me, it is a weak point on the puppet.

That the booster actually increases the weak point, I disagree that this isnt balanced.

First, stop telling people 'they're wrong' I don't give a crap how much of our rules you think you've read and know but you've proven time and time again that you don't know anywhere close to what you think you do.  Grim's item buffs his chakra, and his puppet speed. It works in the same way as an item that would buff speed and reaction time. You can only put 25 points into a substat directly, but if that substat is totaled from a direct + or - from a main stat then buffing the main stat directly also buffs the substat. This only works in niche situations. Your speed item? Only one of them works, shocking I know. Want proof? Go look at anyone's stat page. Only three people have different +25 item buffs and they specifically have to state which one they're using in each thread without the ability to change it. Everyone else? Just +25 to one main stat and +25 to two different substats max. 

I don't really care if you're adamant about the mechanisms base purposes. Because I'm adamant about that being a skill. Your lack of an actual argument for it points to you acknowledging that your puppet does nothing in it of itself to cause that skill to be a thing, and what is a mechanism? A group or parts working together in something to make it happen. Your first ability is a skill. 

Honestly, I think the entire attempt to make your puppet just fall apart and build itself back up when a friggin DR shield does the same job, only better, as it allows storage device to work properly, etc is silly. You can literally make the puppet collapsible at the joints only without having that clause about damage immunity that simply doesn't make sense (Since your puppets parts are still physically there, and all). 

I don't really see why you're going into so much detail about math regarding this shit. I told you to cap the AP storage at 100. I don't really care about all of the math. Because it's completely unnecessary. You look at stamina and go 'Ha, I don't need that' So you can further try to break shit by applying your stats elsewhere, etc. It's my job to make sure you don't get to do that. So the limit is the preapproved cap from the base precedent. Period. 

And that booster? Doesn't balance it, it's you trying to shove in another mechanism so you can try to get as much crap by as possible. Remove it. 

Regardless of what your next slew of arguments where you condescendingly tell me that I'm wrong and you're right will include math wise. The BELOW edit requests, are in fact what I'm locked in on. To clarify, here's where I'm at. 

You do not get your first mechanism, edit it to something else. 

Your 'fall apart' mechanism needs a cap on physical damage it can take before it just breaks outright. To be honest, I dislike it even with that cap. Regardless, it also needs a speed of disassemble and reassembly. Also, just make it so that you can fully repair/regenerate/rebuild your puppet from the Earth around it for like 45 AP to match your speed. Then make ability only useable once per thread. Also say you cannot clone your puppet in this way. 

Change your batteries AP cap to 100 and remove the booster from the mechanism. 

Barrier: Fine

Escape Pod: Fine

That's it, either edit or not. Bump regardless.